Another "Newbie" in need of assistance

#1
I received my XT+ yesterday and spent the evening unboxing and getting it running. I was able to print a test print from the SD Card successfully, but ran into issues when I attempted to print on of my own models.

Issue 1: When I sliced my model using S3D and went to print, the gcode file did not wait for the hot end to heat fully before attempting to print. Upon examination the line "M109 S<temp> T0" was not added by S3D. This happens with every gcode file test I have made.

Issue 2: After adding in M109 to the S3D file, printer "raised" hot end and heated successfully, but when it raised it prior to heating it made a strange sound which I think actually lowered the head further into the bed. After the print started, it dragged & dug the hot end into the bed.

Issue 3: After "recovering" from Issue 2, I was experiencing some weird behavior when homing the axis. I would select "Auto Home" off the LCD and the X & Y would home okay but the Z would move to center & lift up but not come down to touch the build plate. And when attempting to print after that, the Z would seem to think it is at bed level when it is actually not and attempt to self level & print in mid-air. (see video link) I would have to turn off the printer a few times before the homing would work fine again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD-_ocfUQFA

Issue 4 (last one, I promise): On a print I attempted using Slic3r, the first layer went down okay; however it appeared as if the Z axis was not moving up and the head was grinding into the print (another video).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBt844fSRo4

Any and all help is greatly appreciated.
 
#2
Make sure you are using a start gcode script that calls bed leveling and sets temperature.

Code:
G28 X0 Y0 ; Home X and Y axis
G28 ; Home all axis
G29 ; Auto bed leveling probe
M218 T1 X33.90 Y-0.3; Set 2nd extruder offset. This method is better than setting in in the extruder tab since it can be updated easily later
M201 X600 Y600; Set X and Y acceleration values
M204 S600; Set default acceleration
G1 Z15 F5000; Raise nozzle
M106 S[0]; Turn off fan
M104 S[extruder0_temperature] T0; Layer 1 temperature for extruder 0
M109 S[extruder0_temperature] T0; Layer 1 temperature for extruder 0
G1 X210 Y210 Z5 F9000
Does your BL touch bed leveling sensor occasionally blink when you power the printer?
 
#3
Here is my start g-Code:

Code:
G28 X0 Y0 ; Home X and Y axis
G28 ; Home all axis
G29 ; Auto bed leveling probe
M218 T1 X33.90 Y-0.3; Set 2nd extruder offset. This method is better than setting in in the extruder tab since it can be updated easily later
M201 X600 Y600; Set X and Y acceleration values
M204 S600; Set default acceleration
G1 Z15 F5000; Raise nozzle
M106 S[0]; Turn off fan
M104 S[extruder0_temperature] T0; Layer 1 temperature for extruder 0
M109 S[extruder0_temperature] T0; Layer 1 temperature for extruder 0
M104 S[extruder1_temperature] T1; Layer 1 temperature for extruder 1
M109 S[extruder1_temperature] T1; Layer 1 temperature for extruder 1
G1 X210 Y210 Z5 F9000
Despite the M109 being in there and the check on the left extruder for "Wait for Temperature controller...", the M109 does not get added to the file.

Yes it does.

Side note. I just tried yet another print and after a few false starts (i.e. Z axis not touching bed at first turn on), the print continually fails. After bed leveling, there is a grinding noise when it tries to raise the z axis to heat. I am working on getting the video for this now.
 
#5
Okay, so now I am stumped even more. I sliced the gCreate calibration cube using Slic3r and I cannot get it to print. I modified the gcode after slicing so as to not heat up the second extruder and all I get is the extruder moving to the center of the build plate after heating is complete and then nothing. The LCD says "Heating Done..." but it does not seem to print. I even have to remove the SD card before the LCD "wakes up" and lets me do anything with it.

I am trying to keep calm and not get overly frustrated over these setbacks. It was so promising when the first test print from the SD card came out just fine (except not wanting to come off the bed :lol:).

Please, any and all help with these issues (both here and previous posts) is greatly appreciated.
 
#6
davec3275 said:
Okay, so now I am stumped even more. I sliced the gCreate calibration cube using Slic3r and I cannot get it to print. I modified the gcode after slicing so as to not heat up the second extruder and all I get is the extruder moving to the center of the build plate after heating is complete and then nothing. The LCD says "Heating Done..." but it does not seem to print. I even have to remove the SD card before the LCD "wakes up" and lets me do anything with it.

I am trying to keep calm and not get overly frustrated over these setbacks. It was so promising when the first test print from the SD card came out just fine (except not wanting to come off the bed :lol:).

Please, any and all help with these issues (both here and previous posts) is greatly appreciated.
What are you're rapid speeds set for?
Maybe too high and causing your z motors to skip. The motors are definitely skipping, just need to find out why.
 
#7
Jarhead said:
davec3275 said:
Okay, so now I am stumped even more. I sliced the gCreate calibration cube using Slic3r and I cannot get it to print. I modified the gcode after slicing so as to not heat up the second extruder and all I get is the extruder moving to the center of the build plate after heating is complete and then nothing. The LCD says "Heating Done..." but it does not seem to print. I even have to remove the SD card before the LCD "wakes up" and lets me do anything with it.

I am trying to keep calm and not get overly frustrated over these setbacks. It was so promising when the first test print from the SD card came out just fine (except not wanting to come off the bed :lol:).

Please, any and all help with these issues (both here and previous posts) is greatly appreciated.
What are you're rapid speeds set for?
Maybe too high and causing your z motors to skip. The motors are definitely skipping, just need to find out why.
I have not changed any of the speeds in either Slic3r or S3D post import of the XT+'s profiles. Defaults for Slic3r is 70mm/s for perimiters and 85mm/s for infill and I believe S3D is the same.
 

AlexD

New Member
#8
From the first video you posted it seems that the Z Min Endstop is already triggered as it attempts to home the Z, this is apparent because the Z Probe SHOULD touch the bed then raise up a few mm and probe again, yours moves up straight away (because it believes it has probed), then does nothing after indicating its reading as triggered.

Does that error only occur when using S3D?

Thanks

Alex
 
#9
AlexD said:
From the first video you posted it seems that the Z Min Endstop is already triggered as it attempts to home the Z, this is apparent because the Z Probe SHOULD touch the bed then raise up a few mm and probe again, yours moves up straight away (because it believes it has probed), then does nothing after indicating its reading as triggered.

Please go into S3D and check the endstop status of the printer using M119 in the command line whilst the head is in the air and idle, this will indicate if what i am saying is the case.

The causes for this could be either be:

-The logic of the endstop is not inverted in the firmware.
-The wires are the wrong way round on the ramps.

However all of the above could be completely irrelevant altogether because you say you already had a good test print.

Make sure the BLTouch probe pin is clean and can move freely, does the probe self test when powered on??

Thanks

Alex
I will certainly check that out. However, I believe it isn't the firmware as in using Slic3r the Z moves accordingly after the auto leveling and does not grind/bind as with S3D. Also, yes the BLTouch does move freely and self test on power up.
 
#10
If you're sure the speed is good, make sure to check the voltage on your drivers next.
Not sure what gCreate sets them to, but with a 12v power supply you should see around .3 - .4 volts max.
If over that you'll definitely skip your motors.
 
#11
Okay, first of all thanks to everyone who has replied thus far. All of the suggestions are really helpful.

Second, I have been working off-line with Kyle and am taking a stepped approach. Since I can print the test print g-code files on the provided SD Card with zero issues (well, at least temperature and z-axis wise), it was decided to first make sure the BLTouch was at the correct level. SO, I spent last evening adjusting both the dual extruders as well as the BLTouch and I believe I have them where they need to be. A business card will barely slide under the extruders when the Z-axis is at 0.

However, when I attempt to print the "Large Bed Calibration Object" from the SD Card I do not get a "perfect" print. For starters, the front left "corner" of the print/bed separates from the bed every time I attempted to print it.

In addition to that, I also noticed that the initial pass of the first layer was not super squished; however the second pass of the first layer was. There was also some "stringing" around some of the curves of the print which were not there on previous attempts.

Any other suggestions would be great! I feel I am super close. I have such high hopes for this printer and have not been able to print anything substantial for a while now and when I received this printer I became super excited to get back to my various projects.

Here are some pics of the latest test print for reference.

Thanks again!





First layer




 

AlexD

New Member
#12
Dave, one thing to understand about Marlin's Auto Bed Level is it will not compensate for an un-even bed. There is a difference between an un-level and an un-even bed. An un-level bed could be 100% Flat, but still angled slightly from one end to the other, Marlin can compensate for this. However an un-even bed would be where there are high a low spots or hills on the bed, Marlin cannot compensate for this at the moment. Try to identify if the are low spots where the print is lifting, the acrylic is a real challenge to make sure it is completely flat, at work we have a £150,000 calibration sander that can sand writing off of paper, however even after calibrating the acrylic through it, it is still sometimes uneven; glass is imo a much better print surface.

The problem you describe with having a thicker or more squished line on the outside perimeter could be down to a few factors:

- The outside line is usually slower than the inside, this could be giving the plastic more time to be pushed down into the bed as the hotend moves.
- The extrusion width in S3D could be tuned to make the Perimeter lines further or closer to each other - so in other words: the first line could be extruded where it should be, but if the second line is extruded too close to the first, it would have less room to extrude and squish against the first line. I'm not sure how the gMax S3D settings are now, but usually i leave the extrusion width on 'Auto', so for my 0.4mm Nozzle it will allow a 0.48mm Extrusion Width, this seems to give me pretty similar lines. I think this is something you will need to play with and obviously some filaments behave different to others so it can be a constantly changing parameter.

Thanks

Alex
 
#13
AlexD said:
Dave, one thing to understand about Marlin's Auto Bed Level is it will not compensate for an un-even bed. There is a difference between an un-level and an un-even bed. An un-level bed could be 100% Flat, but still angled slightly from one end to the other, Marlin can compensate for this. However an un-even bed would be where there are high a low spots or hills on the bed, Marlin cannot compensate for this at the moment. Try to identify if the are low spots where the print is lifting, the acrylic is a real challenge to make sure it is completely flat, at work we have a £150,000 calibration sander that can sand writing off of paper, however even after calibrating the acrylic through it, it is still sometimes uneven; glass is imo a much better print surface.

The problem you describe with having a thicker or more squished line on the outside perimeter could be down to a few factors:

- The outside line is usually slower than the inside, this could be giving the plastic more time to be pushed down into the bed as the hotend moves.
- The extrusion width in S3D could be tuned to make the Perimeter lines further or closer to each other - so in other words: the first line could be extruded where it should be, but if the second line is extruded too close to the first, it would have less room to extrude and squish against the first line. I'm not sure how the gMax S3D settings are now, but usually i leave the extrusion width on 'Auto', so for my 0.4mm Nozzle it will allow a 0.48mm Extrusion Width, this seems to give me pretty similar lines. I think this is something you will need to play with and obviously some filaments behave different to others so it can be a constantly changing parameter.

Thanks

Alex
Alex,

Is there an easy way to determine where the acrylic is uneven? Is running the large calibration object or is there a better method/object to print?
 
#14
I will just tell you that my piece of boro glass out of the box had 7-8 low spots in it where ABL did not help, and the print would not stick... THe glass I got with my heated bed is much better.
 
#15
dunginhawk said:
I will just tell you that my piece of boro glass out of the box had 7-8 low spots in it where ABL did not help, and the print would not stick... THe glass I got with my heated bed is much better.
Thanks for that. However while I want to upgrade to the heated bed option I do not want to do it now. Most of my projects are using PLA, so a heated bed is not a necessity.

Are there any other options I can try?
 
#16
Sure, you could always just go to lowes and have a custom piece cut (i think 16.5 x 16.25 inches works, but please measure yourself and account for clips) or glass...
Its not the highest quality or thickest glass but it works.
After that you could use glue, painters tape, buildtak or my favorite, PEI. I use 3m adhesive sheets + PEI to get it on the glass.
thanks
 
#17
Well, before I go investing in a piece of glass what can I do to the acrylic plate first? Currently the surface has quite a few scratches and gorge marks from the instances when the extruder was dug into the bed while attempting to print with S3D. Do I try to sand them out? or simply flip the acrylic over and start using the bottom?
 

AlexD

New Member
#18
davec3275 said:
Alex,

Is there an easy way to determine where the acrylic is uneven? Is running the large calibration object or is there a better method/object to print?
The print is probably pthe best way, unless you have a straight edge that you can lay accross to try and check for gaps.

I find this one good as it hits all the corners properly, we could model something up no problem if you wanted some serious detail.

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:990327

Cheers

Alex
 
#20
Flip the boro glass over. I had a LITTLE better luck with the underside being flat, not perfect, but better...
You will need to sand it down a bit (1500 grit sandpaper) to get a rough enough edge to hold prints, but that should give you a new surface by which to test from.
I would still get glass in the end, its just much more precise.